Astrostudents-Group Discussions: [astrostudents] Re: Upayagers or Astrologers ?

Most Respected Prabhakar ji, pranam
Sir, as a student (and a follower of old school) i find your posts really helpful and knowledgeable.
kindly advise if the below remedy can be prescribed for sun 5th and Jupiter 10th(at the same time)?
thanks
yours truly
Jitin Syal

--- In astrostudents@yahoogroups.com, Yograj Prabhakar <yr_prabhakar@...> wrote:
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> Respected Finn Sahib,
>
> I am also a big fan of this remedy like your good-self but, for a different reason. I recommended this remedy (for Venus 4th or Rahu 5th) to hundreds of my clients. As we are all very well aware that the holy Lal kitab is very secular in nature, but practically I found "remarriage" one of the "most secular" remedy mentioned in this divine scripture. five of my Christians and more than two dozen Hindu clients got remarried in the Sikh Gurudwaras, Three Muslim clients from Aligarh "re-tied" their nuptial knots in Hindu temples. Two Parsi clients also choose a temple for this purpose. Even I got remarried 3 times - twice in a temple and once in a Gurudwara (as the priest of that temple was out of station).
>
> I would also like to share the positive effects of this remedy. One childless Muslim client from Aligarh in the state of Uttar Pradesh who was married for 16 years and having two wives, and another childless Muslim guy from the same city who was married for more than a decade was blessed with male child after performing this remedy. Interestingly, in both of the cases caesarian operations were performed for child birth.
>
> I wanted to send this message directly to you because, I was afraid that members will treat it as a self propagation act, but I wanted to assure everybody in the forum that I just shared my views on the above-mentioned subject and have no other motive.
>
> Respectfully
> Yograj Prabhakar
>
> --- On Fri, 5/6/09, Finn Wandahl <finn.wandahl@...> wrote:
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> From: Finn Wandahl <finn.wandahl@...>
> Subject: [astrostudents] Re: Upayagers or Astrologers ?
> To: astrostudents@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Friday, 5 June, 2009, 6:59 PM
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> Dear Jitin,
>
> Quote: > if someone with venus in 4th house approached you, you would advice him
> to re-marry his wife(after changing her name), then how can you predict
> that he would have 2 wives? if on one hand an astrologer hopes that his
> remedy would work, how can he predict the opposite(he can only fear and
> advice). <
>
> Actually, I am very fond of this particular Upaya. When I was in India back in 1990 some astrologer friends told me about a young man who consulted an old astrologer to get advice about his future marriage. However, the old astrologer found indications of widowhood in his chart and as a remedy he told the young man first to marry a Peepal tree, and then only after the Peepal tree had died he should marry the young girl in question.
>
> In arrangement with his family the young man soon married the Peepal tree and after the tree had died he married to girl, and the story tells they lived happily ever after. There were rumours that his would-be in-laws had put copper nails into the root of the Peepal tree to speed up the process, but I have no idea if this was actually true or not.
>
> I see no contradiction neither in the example given by you nor in the story about the Peepal tree. In both cases an attempt has been made to alter the future reality a little in order to avoid widowhood or the sadness of a separation, and still keep the major picture in the predicting of two marriages in mind. I think, sometimes this can be done, sometimes not, depending upon the karmas and situation of the planets in the charts of the couple.
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> There is a philosophical explanation to all this. As it is, we are already changing destiny by looking into the horoscope in the first place. Actually, knowledge of things to come may sometimes change the final outcome.
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> The old Hindu astrologers believed there are two kinds of Karmas: 1) Sthira Karma, which is indicated by the Janma Kundali itself, the results of which is almost completely fixed and pre-destinated. 2) Utpala Karma, indicated by Gochara (transits), the Varshphal kundali or by the Prashna Kundali, the results of which is ever changing and not fixed.
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> In case of difference between the two kind of Karma, the Utpala Karma were said to prevail, if prayers, remedies etc. were performed.
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> For many years I always used both the Janma Kundali and the Prashna Kundali, side by side, in order to get the punya right by observing both these kinds of Karma at the same time.
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> As Lal Kitab astrologers, you can say we use both Janma Kundali (Sthira karma) and Varshphal kundalis (Utpala karma) side by side for somewhat similar reasons.
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> Best wishes,
> Finn
>
>
> --- In astrostudents@ yahoogroups. com, "jitinsyal82" <jitinsyal82@ ...> wrote:
> >
> > respected finn sir,
> > my knowledge is no where as near as you or anyone else in this group for that matter, however i do feel that in lal kitab sometimes recommending remedies and predicting can contradict each other.
> >
> > please correct me if i am wrong but,for example if someone with venus in 4th house approached you, you would advice him to re-marry his wife(after changing her name), then how can you predict that he would have 2 wives? if on one hand an astrologer hopes that his remedy would work, how can he predict the opposite(he can only fear and advice).
> > please share your experience on above.
> > thank you
> > sincerely
> > Jitin Syal
> >
> > --- In astrostudents@ yahoogroups. com, "Finn Wandahl" finn.wandahl@ wrote:
> > >
> > > Dear Members,
> > >
> > > The discussion going on at the moment is very interesting to follow. The
> > > importance of Tewa Darusthi is being emphasized, which is always very
> > > good, since Lal Kitab is an Ascendant-based kind of astrology. I have
> > > been able to notice bad examples of Lal Kitab astrologers giving out
> > > Upayas to people without doing any kind of Tewa Darusthi. This means
> > > these ignorant astrologers cannot possibly be sure if the chart is
> > > correctly calculated or not.
> > >
> > > As a matter of fact this is not the first time a problem like this have
> > > been seen in India. Around the 7th century AD the great
> > > astronomer/astrolog er Varaha Mihira wrote that a miscalculation of an
> > > astrologer is as sinful as the murder of a Brahmin. Actually, I think
> > > this proves that there was astrologers who was indiscriminately using
> > > wrong chart even at the time of Varaha Mihira. Otherwise he would never
> > > have given such a strong statement.
> > >
> > > My personal opinion is that any astrologer who is using an
> > > Ascendant-based kind of astrology without verifying whether or not the
> > > Ascendant is correct is nothing but a big charlatan. However, this goes
> > > on every day and it surely gives a bad name to Lal Kitab, when the
> > > charlatans belong to this category of astrologers. Anyway, there is not
> > > so much we can do about this problem, except to do our very best when
> > > we, who are supposed to be the good guys, do the horoscopes ourselves.
> > > But are we really doing our best, or are some of us perhaps getting a
> > > little lazy? This is actually a very important question. Since - after
> > > all - no astrologer, however big or famous, is any better than the last
> > > horoscope he did.
> > >
> > > There is a certain critizism about Lal Kitab astrologers that I have
> > > often among the other kinds of Hindu astrologers and even among some few
> > > western astrologers as well. They say, when you consult a Lal Kitab
> > > astrologer, he will ask you a number of highly relevant questions about
> > > your life, which clearly confirms the correctness of your chart, and he
> > > would even pin-point at certain events going on in certain years of the
> > > past. He may even say thing about the present situations, being
> > > precisely correct. But when it comes to the future, he either can or
> > > will not give any predictions at all, but rather gives a large number of
> > > Upayas (remedies) to guard agains any bad elements in the near future,
> > > normally without even telling what malefic event the remedy is supposed
> > > to guard against.
> > >
> > > No doubt a lot of relevant things are being said during an Lal Kitab
> > > consultation. I mean say, if Saturn is malefic in the 6th in the
> > > Varshphal we would caution against buying new leather shoes in that
> > > year. This is in my opinion a good and sound piece of astrological
> > > advice. And we have a lot of relevant information like that to share
> > > with our clients. But given the knowledge about the past and present
> > > that we present to the client, isn't it only natural that he/she also
> > > expect something like that to be said about the future? And not only
> > > Upayas, however relevant they may be.
> > >
> > > I think there is some element of truth is this critizism against Lal
> > > Kitab astrologers. If I am right then we need to ask ourselves some
> > > questions: Are we becoming so arrogant against astrology that we no
> > > longer care about giving predictions about the future? Did Pt. Roop
> > > Chand Joshi ever say anything against giving predictions about the
> > > future? (Except of course that predictions should be given with due
> > > caution and all the necessary ethical consideration, etc. etc.). Are we
> > > somehow forgetting what it means to be astrologers? Are we developing
> > > into Upayagers rather then Astrologers?
> > >
> > > Best regards,
> > > Finn Wandahl
> > >
> >
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