Respected Goel ji, it is a pleasant surprise. I never expected such
an answer from ur goodself. Yes it is definitely knowledge of pre
BPHS. Although discussion on this topic is curtailed. I couldn't help
myself from doing a dandvat to you. If u know that much then u must be
knowing much much more about lalkitab. Lots of Respect and Regards.
Kulbir.
On 7/12/09, Gopal Goel <gkgoel1937@yahoo.
> Dear Mr. Wandahl,
> The knowledge given by sages is universal and belongs to humanity all
> over the world . You have as much right as any Indian.
> I FRANKLY DO NOT HAVE ANY IDEA AS TO HOW THIS GREAT KNOWLEDGE
> DAWNED IN THE HEART OF GREAT SAINT AND SAGE Pt. ROOPCHANDJI.
> is very clear that:
> 1. He had penned all the five books in the local language prevalent in the
> area he was residing
> 2. He had used idiomatic language prevalent in that area even the slang's.
> These are not easily understood
> in the rest of the country
> 3. Remedial measure suggested in lalkitab were more suited in the country
> side of his residence
> 4.Though Pt. ROOPCHAND JI HAD NOT CLAIMED ITS AUTHORSHIP, BUT HIS WORKS ARE
> IN
> ORIGINAL AND INNOVATIVE FORMAT. He took almost 13 years to complete all
> the five volumes.
> Now lets discuss the era of BPHS.after 5000 bc , there was comparatively cam
> period in India.
> In the field of astrology lot of new techniques were being developed. As I
> have written in my previous mail
> Panchang was devolved(weekdays, Lunar Tithis, Karna , Yogas'-sum of Moon's
> and Sun's longitude
> on the basis of SIDEREAL SIGNS ,and 27 NAKSHATRAS based on Moon)
> It will be pertinent to understand that even much after commencement of
> CHRISTIAN ERA ,it was not practically possible to pin point the location
> of V.E.Point in the ZODIAC. As such , the question of using Tropical signs
> did not arise.In the Era of Vahaha Mihira , both zodiacs' were almost
> coinciding , as such if some one says
> Surya Siddhanta had adopted Tropical signs , this statement is of no
> value.
> Now lets come back to ERA of BPHS when it was being created AND
> DEVOLVED( around 2000BC) , the use of ascending point , 12 bhava , 12 signs
> and 27 Nakshatra and placement and movement of Nine planets in these bhavas
> and signs was being developed.A vast literature was created which observed
> and recorded the effects of planets movement in Nakshatras' BHAVAS AS WELL
> AS THEIR MUTUAL PLACEMENT . FOR THIS PURPOSE
> THEY HAVE DEVISED VARIOUS CHAKRAS AND HOROSCOPES. All Bhirgu ,Nadi and
> Samhita litrature
> is the creation of pre BPHS ERA. IT IS MY FEELING THAT THIS EXCELLENT
> KNOWLEDGE WAS DAWNED
> IN THE HEART OF Pt.. ROOPCHAND JI, WHO had DISTRIBUTED IT TO ALL MANKIND
> IN THE FORM THAT THEY CAN BENEFIT FROM THIS GREAT SCIENCE.
> BPHS AND JAIMINI'S UPDESH SUTRA ARE A STEP FORWARD IN THE DEVELOPMENT IN THE
> FIELD OF
> ASTROLOGY.But we must gain understanding of pre -BPHS ERA literature, AS
> CLEARLY INDICATED IN ITS CHAPTER 3.
> SIMILARLY SUTRAS SAY IN ITS FIRST CHAPTER THAT GAIN MASTERY OVER HORA
> SHASTRA.
> IT SHOLD NOW CLEAR THAT BHIRGU SUTRA ( MPST OF IT STILL KEPT SECRET BY
> PERSONS LIKE BHATT) ARUN SAMHITA ,LALKITAB ,BPHS , UPDESH SUTRA ARE PART AND
> PARCEL OF THE OVERALL ASTROLOGICAL DEVELOPMENT ININDIA.
> As regard some young astrologers from Kerla is not able to appreciate this
> view..But this is not the case with
> more mature and older generation of astrologers from Kerala , some of them
> were my teachers.
> Regards,
>
>
>
> G.K.GOEL
> Ph: 09350311433
> Add: L-409, SARITA VIHAR
> NEW DELHI-110 076
> INDIA
>
>
>
>
> ____________
> From: Finn Wandahl <finn.wandahl@
> To: astrostudents@
> Sent: Tuesday, 7 July, 2009 1:12:48 AM
> Subject: [astrostudents] Re: Ashok ji; why study astrology?
>
>
>
>
>
> Dear Mr. Vipin Shukla,
>
> This is not the first time we disagree, but perhaps this time, on this
> particular issue, we can at least agree to disagree, now when the
> members of this group has been able to see both our arguments.
>
> What I have stated about Parasara Hora is based on my own personal
> findings and research in cooperation with a certain sanskrit-scholar
> from Kerala, whom I am sure wish to remain unknown in this present
> discussion, for obvious reasons.
>
> I very much believe this to be the truth about Parasara Hora, but taking
> your very religious position on this matter into consideration (and
> respecting it) it clearly appears that further discussion on this topic
> will be futile, leading to nowhere.
>
> However, being a foreigner I can speak my opinion on this matter freely,
> and I like to say very frankly that being discontented by nearly 30
> years of studying and practicing Parasari astrology is what actually
> made me seek refuge into the great Lal Kitab.
>
> Your position regarding who originated or wrote the great Lal Kitab is a
> little unclear in your last message. What do you mean? Do you have doubt
> that it was the late Pt. Roop Chand Joshi who wrote the five books of
> Lal Kitab? Please elaborate on this?
>
> Best wishes,
> Finn Wandahl
>
> --- In astrostudents@ yahoogroups. com, "lalkitabee" <lalkitabee@ ...>
> wrote:
>>
>> Res Mr. Wandahl,
>> Ur views are really very illustrative & u also indicated about the
> history of astro-shastra, but the person like me do not depends on the
> sources,which were provided by any persian,chinese or christian scholar
> only.Beside explaining more in words,I want to inform u that Bhartiya
> Gyaan Peeth is an authentic publication by Indian govt for researchers
> ,so the book named "BHARTIYA JYOTISH" written by DR.NEMICHAND SHASTRI,
> PUBLISHED BY BHARTIYA GYAAN PEETH is more authentic for the history of
> this Bhartiya Jyotish.Ur reading says that it is not older that 500
> years & my reading says ,it is 28000 years old in india.U can get
> references regarding this in that book.I found it at page no. 8 of that
> book according RIGVED & SHATPATH BRAHMAN. U also agree with SHATPATH
> BRAHMAN, bcoz as per ur website "Brahman is real,
>> the Universe is unreal,
>> Brahman is the Universe.( It can be raised as a topic that u
> might not accept SHATPATH BRAHMAN also so much old)
>> I do not want to fall in this controversy bcoz this will lead us
> nowhere.It is the bad luck of India that invaders were attracted to this
> country & tried to ruin treasure of our sages.So leave this controversy
> please, because it will be the topic of our Identity & devotion to our
> sages, for which we will depend on our revered forefathers at all.We
> cant depend like Maxmooler, Keeth,Peterson or Vallentine etc.only, even
> they were the best scholars of Sanskrit & Vedas.
>> We are discussing at lalkitab & if each of this group follow as per
> ur evidencial way ,the name of Pt.Roopchand Joshi ji also will be futile
> with Lalkitab,bcoz it was published with the name of Pt.Girdhari Lal Ji
> & Pandit Roop Chand Ji is not present phisically to claim on it..No-one
> of this group accept this fact,bcoz the truth has been established by
> some revered members. In the same way our revered forfathers also
> established about Maharishis & spirituality in Vedas as wel as astrology
> shastra also. Though u want to continue discussion,then no doubt I &
> many like me will consider ur views as blasphemy.U can understand that
> no discussion can go ahead at the sake of our forefathers & their
> verdicts.
>> With Regards
>> Pt.Lalkitabee
>> V.Shukla
>> --- In astrostudents@ yahoogroups. com, "Finn Wandahl" finn.wandahl@
> wrote:
>> >
>> > Dear Mr. V.. Shukla,
>> >
>> > Unfortunately there are many illusions connected to Hindu astrology,
> and
>> > many of these illusions have emerged because of a mix-up between
>> > astrology and religion. This have given rise to all sorts of
>> > misunderstandings regarding the chronology and the origin of the
>> > different astrological texts of Hindu astrology.
>> >
>> > The mere fact that a certain text-book has been named after some
> Vedic
>> > Sage, does not necessarily mean that this Sage was actually the
> author
>> > of that text.
>> >
>> > Even though many people believe a text like
> Brihat-Parasara- Hora-Shastra
>> > to be more than 4,000 years old, a critical analysis of the
>> > sanskrit-text and the content itself for anachronism, etc.
> indicate it
>> > to be hardly more than some 500 years old.
>> >
>> > The Persian astronomer/astrolog er Al Biruni was a great
> sanskrit-scholar
>> > and he visited India around the year 1,000AD. In his book India he
> has
>> > carefully mentioned all the astrological text know at that time,
> there
>> > was Saravali, Brihat Jataka and many other famous texts. However, he
> did
>> > not mention BPHS, which is supposed to be the most important of all
> the
>> > text. Had it been in exixtance he would undoubtedly have mentioned
> it.
>> >
>> > Obviously BPHS is a compendium consisting of all kinds of
> disconnected
>> > astrological material that was indiscriminately collected and
> written
>> > together somewhere around the 16th century AD, probably in two parts
>> > over a period of around 100 years.
>> >
>> > It is possible BPHS was supposed to have been included as a part of
>> > Vishnu Purana. This is actually very possible since VP had been
> changed
>> > so many times already and both VP and BPHS are framed as a
> conversation
>> > between Sage Parasara and his disciple Maitriya. There are so many
>> > textual similarities between the two works.
>> >
>> > I do not share the general admiration about BPHS. I find it to be
> full
>> > of disconnected fragments of astrological methods and full of
>> > contradictions. I think perhaps its similarity with Vishnu Purana is
> was
>> > has made it so famous, and made so many believe it was written by
> the
>> > great Vedic sage Parasara himself 4,000 years ago.
>> >
>> > I have publicly advocated against these illusions and many Hindu
>> > astrologers considered these opinions of mine like blasphemy. I
> however
>> > believe it is wise of us to keep an open, critical mind and not
> become
>> > to "religious" about these things.
>> >
>> > Best wishes,
>> > Finn Wandahl
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --- In astrostudents@ yahoogroups. com, lalkitabee <lalkitabee@ >
> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Res Mr. Wandahl & Yograj ji
>> > > It is not fare at all.Both of u completely vanished the
> spirituality
>> > not only of Lalkitab but the whole of astrology also.Even lalkitab
> is
>> > also a astrological script but which book itself indicates about- 9
>> > NIDHI & 12 SIDDHI, NATURAL SECRET IN "BAND MUTTHI", THE HIDDEN
> TREASURE
>> > OF NEW BORNED. BUT (STATUE) SE ROOH NE APNA GHAR KYON POOCHH
> LIYAA,
>> > JHAGDAA ROOH AUR MAAYA KA , etc. How u can neglect these lines from
>> > spiritual touch of this book.Astro Shastra itself is a 2nd mandatory
>> > part of the system to understand the VEDAS. & what are VEDAS
> ,needn't to
>> > explain.Lalkitab is also a chain of ASTROSHASTRA.
>> > > The views of u seem the result of the thought of Western vs
>> > Indian.The spirituality is the base of the whole Indian culture as
> wel
>> > as it reflects in Lalkitab also.No-one bothers in India that
> spiritual
>> > words can be announced only in Mandir or Church or Masjid etc.Indian
>> > culture has spirituality in whole livings & non-livings & at each
>> > step.The thorough knowledge base of Indian culture inspires to
> achieve
>> > CHATURVARG-PHAL- PRAPTI & its peak level has adviced to get MOKSHA.So
> all
>> > of our knowledge base is to get rid from "LAKH-CHAURASI" & in this
>> > process materialistic world is in between. So,If someone wants to
> study
>> > Indian vedic astrology then it has to be in the context of Indian
> ethos
>> > which is basically spiritual in character.
>> > > Res Wandahl Ji u have also knowledge of vedic & jaimini
> astrology.I
>> > want to say that these also were written by MAHARISHI PARASHAR,
>> > MAHARISHI PINGAL, MAHARISHI JAIMINI etc. No-one has called as Doctor
>> > Parashar, Dr. PINGAL or Dr. Jaimini. Which data of knowledge as such
>> > originated by Maharishis, that how can be only a normal scripture,
> It is
>> > itself is a proof to proove this, as spiritual..
>> > > Res yograj Ji, aap is kitaab ko sirf ek novil ka naam de
> rahey
>> > hain. Yah baat aur hai ki ise bataur noval baar baar padhne ke liye
> bola
>> > gayaa hai ,lekin iska gyaan ek Novil ki kahani ke barabar kabhi bhi
> nahi
>> > kahaa ja saktaa. Jis kitab main Pitri Rin,Matri Rin jaise topics ko
> liya
>> > gayaa hai, jis kitab main antar alop ki leharon ka jikra hai, jis
> kitab
>> > main dono bhavon ke beech Guru-sthan ya gurudwar ka jikra kiya gaya
> hai,
>> > jise aam taur par Brahm-sthan bhi kahaa jataa hai ,uske adhyatmik
> pehloo
>> > ko kisi bhi tarah se nakaaraa nahi ja saktaa.
>> > > Aur to aur jis kitab main shuru main hee likhaa ho "RASHI 12
> MAIN
>> > 7 GRAH SE NARAK CHAURASI KAT-TA HAI" is se badaa saboot aur kyaa
> hogaa
>> > iske spiritual hone ka ? Agar meri baat buri lagi ho to muafi ki arz
> hai
>> > aapse.
>> > > With Regards
>> > > Pt.Lalkitabee
>> > > V.Shukla
>> > >
>> >
>>
>
>
>
>
>
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